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Thread: What To Do About Trains

  1. #16
    Trade Mod FallenPixels's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Venuila View Post
    VWT BPs... It seems very difficult to get riders on a 4 stamp BP train these days. 3 stamp MAX I think is more than reasonable with the new increases. If people want to have other options that's great too. I do the "surprise bp" on my trains and love it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Venuila View Post
    I like the idea of a stamp cap on BPs.
    me too, some of them seem to be a bit more like "paying" also some riders have complained that conductors are asking for 4 on VWTs to mail back, using 2-3 and keeping the extra(s) - a SASE would add more weight to envies and may result in a wasted stamp anyway so I don't think its the way to go (it was suggested)

    With the new rates I think we may be better off buying $1.80 stamps for postage too rather than 3 for postage (which results in a lot of wasted $$)

    Quote Originally Posted by Venuila View Post
    I don't usually ride Trad Trains unless there is no BP because of the issues already mentioned. I would ride a 1 stamp Trad if it was from someone in BC because I know they usually have a different variety than the ONT ones.
    I agree, I know some people started asking for them because they were arriving back with crappy coupons so the conductor was out, but often you are taking nothing and using 2-3 stamps to mail it on so the conductor getting an extra stamp seems a bit much
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  2. #17
    Trade Mod FallenPixels's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Venuila View Post
    I've conducted my fair share of VWTs, and it does get costly to replace mistakes. Which is why on my last few trains I have included in the rules that for every mistake you have I am not sending you a coupon for your bundle from myself. If it's a 3 point train, and you send two mistakes that I have to replace you are only receiving one coupon from me. I think that is more than fair.
    I really like this idea
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  3. #18
    Canadian Genius PurpleBunny89's Avatar
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    I stopped conducting trains because I was getting sick and tired of people who never read the rules of the train before joining. Sure, they say they do but its pretty obvious when their envelope arrives that they just skim over your rules and assume they are basically the same as everyone elses.

    I also found that surprisingly when I hosted newbie trains they were the easiest and when I hosted VWT's with seasoned members was when I had the most stress/work of having to correct 75% of the envelopes I received. It just got ridiculous and so I stopped doing it.

    Plus I do agree that there should be better stipulations on what should be considered for a negative. There have been many times as a conductor and a rider where I have felt a user should get neutral or negative but it really ruins everything. Its more trouble to explain to the person why they received it, then have to dispute it with a MOD who very likely will just remove it, then most likely try to get a retaliation rating removed - sometimes its just not worth the trouble. Same thing with when there are mistakes in an envelope - how many should be considered before a negative? Or how bad of a mistake? And again same thing goes with for riders, when I receive an envelope from the conductor and they've approved something that was completely different from my WL is it fair to leave negative for both the rider who sent it and the conductor and again have the headache of having to argue with everyone over ratings.

    And if replacements are sent or the problems are fixed is a neutral rating still going to make people angry? Most likely.

    Its just waaaayyyy too much work now a days so if I do host a train in the future it will most likely just be newbie trains. And I doubt riding any for the forseable future, it doesn't matter how specific your wishlist is you will always get mistakes.
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  4. #19
    Mastermind bargain_hunter_lola's Avatar
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    I've hosted more trains than I can count.

    Lately (for the past 4-6 months) I've been feeling like it just isn't worth it any more. I've continued to host simply because I enjoy doing it but now it seems like I can't ignore the obvious any more -- It's time to retire. I'm getting WAY less than I give out, I'm not receiving FB as I should be, I'm having to badger people to communicate, and now the CP increase.

    Here are some of the major issues I've seen recently:

    Hosting a Traditional Train - I usually don't ask for a BP since I agree with the thought that we're all putting things in, but the amount of times they go missing is a big risk for a conductor. It would be different if I wasn't putting in GOOD coupons and didn't care that the train went missing but then what would be the point? We want trains with GOOD coupons not crap! Plus the amount of people that don't rate the conductor is getting insane (same with trades and other types of trains though).

    Joining a Traditional Train - I don't join these very often any more because as others have said it's not worth it when you're paying a 2-3 stamp BP and find nothing you want. Then there's always the risk the train goes MIA and you may receive a neutral, or someone puts crap in the train and people wonder if it's you.

    Hosting Secret Senders - This used to be my favourite train to host but lately the amount of people that mysteriously don't receive is getting WAY too high. It used to happen that maybe 1 person on 10 trains didn't receive, now it's more like 1 person for each train... Doesn't make sense to me... Plus communication has gone WAY down. I feel like I'm chasing people to find out what's going on. I hate the feeling of being in the dark because at the end of the day it's my train and I do feel a responsibility BUT there's only so much I can do.

    Wishlists for this type of train are getting hard also - The vast majority of people are just barely meeting the minimum requirement (I do check and ask people to revise). I read all wishlists and ALL of them are pretty hard!

    VWTs - Most of these issues have been brought up (sending wrong coupons, no communication, mailing late). I love Venuila's idea for substitute coupons! I can't count how many times I've fixed wrong coupons and the person didn't even bother to thank me, let alone repay what I was out!

    BP's are hard because if we max at 2 stamps then that may not even be enough to mail envies home (more often than not they usually sit around 60-70g in my experience depending on train size). Also there's no perk for the conductor to host, they are the one using their envelopes and their time to sort, organize, verify and correct envies. I do like the idea of a BP cap but I'm thinking 3 may be more appropriate. Again it would be a cap, not a mandatory BP - the conductor could ask for only 2 stamps or a surprise, etc. if they so choose.


    I'm not really sure I have any good ideas on how to make trains more effective/worth while. I've tried coming up with solutions but I'm at a loss. It seems like every time I find a possible solution, I think of ways that solution can be manipulated. It saddens me but I do feel like there's a huge amount of traders who are now manipulating the rules to their advantage and abusing the system. My trade rating has always been a source of pride for me and frankly I'm not willing to risk tarnishing it because of how things are going. I'm sick of being out WAY more than I received (especially as a conductor) and I'm sick of trains stressing me out.

    Man, I feel like this whole post is just a bunch of negatives. I'm sorry about that but I'm just really bummed with how the trading/trains have been lately. I'm going to miss hosting and riding trains more than I can express (I may be a little addicted) but I just can't keep doing them, there's way more cons than pros.

    I do hope everyone can ban together and find a solution that works. Trains/trading can be wonderful under the right circumstances.
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  5. #20
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    I agree. I think that there should be no stamps required on traditional trains, as you are already paying a lot to mail out a train, even if it wasn't good. I just had to put in two stamps for a train I got nothing out of, then I had to put 2 more on it to mail out :/
    Last edited by Tinkerbella; Sat, Mar 29th, 2014 at 07:15 PM.
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  6. #21
    Trade Mod FallenPixels's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bargain_hunter_lola View Post
    I'm not really sure I have any good ideas on how to make trains more effective/worth while. I've tried coming up with solutions but I'm at a loss. It seems like every time I find a possible solution, I think of ways that solution can be manipulated. It saddens me but I do feel like there's a huge amount of traders who are now manipulating the rules to their advantage and abusing the system.
    This is exactly why we had to make strict rules for package trains and actually enforce them, it is one thing when someone is out a few coupons but when you spend $50 on a package...
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  7. #22
    Canadian Guru Peachykeen2007's Avatar
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    I have seen this too MANY times, and I just move the coupons to there appropriate category, I know this maybe too much for some conductors but honestly, you never receive ALL wishlists the same day and it only takes a few minutes to do, rather than sending it back for revision as that could take longer

    If it is very obvious that they have less coupons than required on the wishlist even before I move any of the coupons I just send it back and ask them to add more as per the rules of the train

    People cannot use the excuse any more that they don't know what is out there when there is more than 1 thread on here dedicated to coupons and usually have links in the thread linking them


    Quote Originally Posted by FallenPixels View Post
    The issue is more when the conductor states in the rules ALL FPS are 3pts and then there are HV/FPCs as 1pt or it is all coupons that have expired and you physically cant send the person them. The one a conductor contacted me about recently stated 25+ coupons that must be easily obtainable, tearpad, insert etc and then the rest could be FPCs (must be 3pts) packaging etc. The person sent a list of 17 coupons and their 1pts included $1 any heinz etc

    It isn't fair to the people following the conductors wishlist rules and sending a list with easier coupons on it

    Of course if people want to join a no limits / anything goes train - wishlists can be whatever, but when you have guidelines when signing up and they are not followed it gets unfair. It is by far the biggest reason people are giving me when they PM

  8. #23
    Axiomatic Canuck Tbites's Avatar
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    I've read the comments about stamp BPs on traditional trains and kinda want to add my 2 cents. I remember a non-transparent train where 1 rider only got about 2.xx$ worth of coupons out.... if I were that rider I'd be disappointed and as a conductor, I definitely felt guilt.

    Combine that with the increased cost of mailing, I do think trad. trains should start going the route of transparency, at least this way, riders can make a better choice as to whether the train's contents are worth the BP for them.

    The idea of no BP because riders are contributing to the train; works IF all riders respect the rules. I've run trad. trains where example: Jan. 30th expiries were to be replaced with March expiries only.... and yet... when the train arrived home, it contained a bunch of Jan 30th expiries which were never there to begin with There's no way other riders could've known about the sneaky substitution and no way to pin point who it was, but since I keep an Excel spreadsheet of the contents of trains.....

    I think having alternative BPs like wishlist coupons is a good idea, at least this way... everyone including the conductor is merely paying out the cost of mailing and the experience hopefully works out as a "random group trade" where everyone gets something they needed out of it.

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  9. #24
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    I only do traditional trains -and I love them -hey if I get back coupons I need or a few stamps that's great -but with the increase -I feel one stamp is enough (so go ahead and cap it at one stamp)I usually give people an option like the last train I still have running( 1 stamp or 2coupons from my list) and i list how much my train is starting with in coupons like 120.00-i feel that is fair-and then people can decide to ride(pleasedont get rid of traditionals -as I never have enough coupons for virtual trains
    -but do cap the boarding pass-as for coupons on the train (its the luck of the draw-like a slot machine sometime you win-sometimes you find coupons other times very little

  10. #25
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    I do think that some train conductors ask for way too much as a "boarding pass", as a way to ensure that they make some kind of return on their investment of time, and that a cap would be a good thing. But at the same time, I would argue that this issue would be self-limiting if people just didn't sign up for trains that they couldn't afford to participate in. For the same reason, I don't participate in VWT's at all, because I just can't meet the requests of the other riders.

    But honestly I just figure that most of those "problems" are par for the course when you are engaging in mail swaps with strangers across the country. If I'm running a train, I'm hoping that I will get something back, and I'm hoping that it will help out someone en route. I like doing "traditional" trains the best, because when it gets back to me there is usually some kind of a nice surprise inside. And if there isn't, well I'm out $1.34 and an envelope, and a bunch of pieces of paper that I didn't pay anything for in the first place. That probably makes me a minority, but honestly I'm just not worried about it. If it were a really high-value train that I was afraid to lose, then I just wouldn't trust it to Canada Post's regular mail service. I had a cheque take 92 days to cross the country from NS to AB, and an insurance document take two months to reach me from across town. Now, if something really matters, I send it signature-required.
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  11. #26
    Trade Mod FallenPixels's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by coupon girl View Post
    pleasedont get rid of traditionals -as I never have enough coupons for virtual trains
    We are not getting rid of them, just getting some feedback before we set any new guidelines
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  12. #27
    Trade Mod FallenPixels's Avatar
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    I personally miss the days when lots of us RAOKed coupons to each other and it worked out as fair in the end because we all did it and trad trains ran smoothly, even the round robin / endless ones
    But there are a lot of good traders who no longer want to ride/run trains (like Lola says above) so people not sticking to current rules is definitely an issue.
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  13. #28
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  14. #29
    Canadian Genius PurpleBunny89's Avatar
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    Just a side note - I've always hosted 2 stamp BP trains UNLESS it was something where there were more riders on it and it was some kind of contest like my decorate your envie ones people really liked.

    I think 3 stamps should be the BP cap for VWT's and to make it worth the time and investment of conductors they should be given extra wishlist coupons no mater what from each rider. Then its fair that way.

    But yes, agree with Lola, communication is non-existent at times and there is too much chaising everyone around to fix stuff that shouldn't have been a problem in the first place.

    And yes, hosting currently and in the past has been stressfull because of the above mentioned issues so it isn't worth it for some of us anymore.
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  15. #30
    Mastermind Anna Michele's Avatar
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    ok so i just came from the p.o.

    apparently the single stamps are marked $1
    the p stamps are only worth 85c
    this might be tough when setting BP's as a p stamp will only cover up to 30g

    2x will only equal 1.70 you wll still need to add 10c

    so a 3 stamp cap on the bp would be fair imo

    but may also still be too costly for me

    as for traditionals I just mailed one and it was $1.80
    Last edited by Anna Michele; Tue, Apr 1st, 2014 at 03:56 PM.
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