Discuss New Rules for Package Trains & Win a Gift Card :)

[coyote00]

You really have a thankless job Ms. Jezebel; I wouldn't wish it on anyone. Kudos to you for your persistance and everending quest to keep the masses happy.

I am happy to hear that we can chatter away because that is indeed what keeps this site up and draws new members.

My final word (for the mo ent) is that we are all adults and have the option to join or not join a train, conduct or not conduct . That said it is un fortunate that we all keep re-hashing the same things over and over again and always the same result.....not everyone is happy. This is a part of life, we can't please everyone all the time. I value everyone's opinion's and hope that each and everyone of you will at some point find a train suitable to your liking.

[Venuila]

I agree slambert and MeShell

If you have to be an active SCer to ride them (which makes sense 100%) then I don't think it's unreasonable to be an active poster in the package thread. After all you are receiving a PACKAGE from someone you don't know that puts alot of thought and care into it just for you .

I don't know what all of the complaints are about but perhaps more structure/deadlines would help?
If there is a max number of riders allowed on the train, have that clearly posted in the first post so riders know how many people could be riding and how active the thread may be. If someone doesn't want to ride one with ALOT of chatter than a train with 40 max people might not be one for you

If there are issues regarding the number of questions being asked then what about a rule like: once WLs have been distributed every rider can ask ONE question - (possibly?) one question only. All questions can be listed in a post at the beginning of the thread, and questions must be received within 4 days of WLs being sent out. If further clarification is needed, then you can contact the conductor to PM your buddy privately.

I'm just brainstorming and trying to help.

[PammieD]

OK my brutal honest has been quiet long enough. I think you have put MORE than enough effort into this min post requirement. If someone cannot commit to 10-15 posts than maybe package trains are just not for them. These trains are not just sign up and get a gift, it is a community of people working very hard to make an awesome package for someone else while we get to know each other and begin friendships. The very least you can do is be active in the thread. I totally understand people have lives and are busy but who is too busy to post 10 times? It's not fair to your buddy who is working hard to make you a beautiful package. That's my opinion on that topic.

That's what she said.

In totally unrelated news, here's Alexa's new buddy

[RSAS]

awe Alexa is so cute!

I think the original post with the minimum posts info is confusing. I also read it has I wasn't allowed to post more then 15 times. I am happy that it was NOT what Jez meant. 10-15 post minimum is very reasonable.

[PammieD]

awe Alexa is so cute!

I think the original post with the minimum posts info is confusing. I also read it has I wasn't allowed to post more then 15 times. I am happy that it was NOT what Jez meant. 10-15 post minimum is very reasonable.

Agreed...I think it's just a case of needing a couple of extra sets of eyes to read and see how they interpret something so that it's clear for everyone. Sometimes I find it hard to clearly convey what I'm thinking because I know what I mean, so I don't always explain it so that others do too....actually, don says I do that when I speak too....uggh...can't win

[FallenPixels]

I wish we could get more ppl who don't ride trains opinions on why they don't and what would need to change ....

I think they have given up looking in this forum, maybe move it into a different forum each day for feedback?

do we allow 1 conductor to run multiple trains at a time ? We have a guideline stating only 1 at a time and not back to back for conductors to host.... if ppl are hosting a train do we allow them to ride other ppls trains ?

No, if they are mailing they should ride one train only. If they are just hosting, then it is different because they won't screw two people at once

no there have been multiple complaints that the post count is too high..either to conduct a train and to ride a train.....more so being able to ride a train

OK my brutal honest has been quiet long enough. I think you have put MORE than enough effort into this min post requirement. If someone cannot commit to 10-15 posts than maybe package trains are just not for them. These trains are not just sign up and get a gift, it is a community of people working very hard to make an awesome package for someone else while we get to know each other and begin friendships. The very least you can do is be active in the thread. I totally understand people have lives and are busy but who is too busy to post 10 times? It's not fair to your buddy who is working hard to make you a beautiful package. That's my opinion on that topic.

For those saying 10 is too low, the complaints came when it was 35 posts, not 10. I was sent an official complaint stating that this was basically forcing people to spam the forum. I agreed with Jezz that there should be some limit, but banning people from future trains because they hit 34 rather than 35 posts does seem unfair

having multiple trains running more frequently you are excluding people from riding because of the only riding 1 train at a time

As far as I am concerned, people do not need to ride every train and the list will be there for people to choose which one suits them more. We also get complaints that for 4+ weeks someone can't ride a train because they dont have kids/pets etc when those trains are running. With multiple trains they could have different themes and people could ride trains at that time

For the min post requirement to be considered "active" to be eligible to ride a package train, what if you did it like a ratio with how long they have been a member of SC. EG someone who has been a member for a year and only has a small number of posts vs someone who has only been on a short time with a small number of posts. That should be a good indicator of how active the member is. Does that make sense?

We have in the past given chances to people with low trade/post ratings because they have been members for 2+ years and in quite a few cases, they disappeared without sending. Jezz and I have both paid out of pocket to send gifts to people to make up for these members

The other option is a private poll at the beginning of the train to decide how many posts are required for that train...so the post count would be chosen for the riders by the riders for each train

The problem with that is that people won't join knowing that the regulars (who are the ones posting in this thread) will choose the higher post values so we will be back to square one

[FallenPixels]

Ok I am going to be brutally honest here and I will not apologize for any of it and this is where I sit as I have been on both ends of conducting and riding

Answering below

TRACKING MANDATORY - we are all aware of the mail date before we join!! and this is referring to those that say "can I mail tomorrow" or "I don't get paid until xx date" - this should be enforced by ALL
I agree with this and think we should be stricter on mail dates and people sending on time etc

30 POSTS - MANDATORY - not hard to do if you try, this really grinds my gears when someone joins, posts requesting a seat, then no one hears from them until mail date and again no one hears from them until they post their gift - this is just simply RUDE in my opinion, it is like you don't give a rats a** that this train is even going on and all you want is your gift! You can't tell me just because what the people in the thread are talking about relates nothing to do with you as the reason you don't post! Not hard to say a simple "hi how's everyone"
I mentioned this above, but the admins were sent an official complaint about being forced to spam, and there are chattier members (as lola and sheets mentioned) who worry they wont miss the post count and be banned from a future train

In regards to the questions - no one ever said people had to answer every question asked but guess what it is helpful to your buddy to do so to give them extra wishes or ideas of what you may like - maybe you sent a really vague wishlist and they just want some more insight! I get that some of the questions asked maybe personal to you and you don't want to answer but it is not manditory, heck I don't answer every question as to me what was the point of sending in a wishlist! I say this because for anyone who has ever had me my wishlist is big and there is tons of things to choose from
I agree that people don't have to answer all questions, but we want to make sure that people do get the answers they need with a lower post count

I like the fact that 1 train runs at a time - that way it is more manageable for the conductor and the mods - we all have other things going on in other places on this site that I personally can't divide myself anymore! Proof was in the pudding last year with the multiple trains at a time

1. limited $$ spent vs No limit -->> guess which train everyone joined!
2. limited rider's vs no limit rider's -- guess which train everyone joined!!
3. allowing rider's to ride more than 1 train at a time -->> guess what happened - PEOPLE DIDN'T SEND but they sure as he*k received both packages and these people were REGULARS not newbies
I think it depends on how they are run, it may just be the ebb and flow. what worked or didn't work before may be different now, we have new members and some older members have left - the newer members have different wants/needs than the ones we had before. We also have a lot of people who used to ride trains before they were banned who no longer do because of the various rules.

In regards to the limited rider's vs no limit rider's I believe the no limit was set as to not offend those who may have missed the limited rider train because of things outside of SC! People will find out that with set limited rider trains that those regulars who are always stalking the train thread will get to the train first before a newbie, it will happen everytime unless the limited rider train is not open to regular rider's and in that case you will most likely also find NO ONE will ride because they want to be paired with a seasoned rider
As above, no limit may have worked with that set of riders but people are asking for limits now, so it isn't fair to those people not to at least try it.

Also I take personal offense when people feel as though they are "out done" or "I didn't spend enough" - if the rules of the train are to send a minimum of 6 items and that is all you sent then be happy with that, why are you worried about what I sent to another rider! No one knows what I spent - some of us can stack for free, some of us use our points (swagbucks/SDM etc) and most of us have goodies stashed away because we have been riding so long!
I have never sent to the same person twice! so guess what, your turning maybe next! everyone's budget is different and the people who send over the board packages and we all know who they are should not be punished for it - if I want to send a extravagant package then I should be allowed to
This is part of the issue, you see it from the point of view of the regulars and longer term members on SC who have a stockpile, who have swagbucks saved up etc - some people are not as 'into it' as some of the longer term members. If you don't want to ride a limit train, don't - but why exclude those who would love to ride a train but can only afford a certain amount and can't puff the gift from their stockpile?

As for people bickering about not being able to conduct - well where ARE you as Jezebel posts all the time looking for conductors! Looking for train ideas and NO ONE speaks up

Like I have said over and over I have no problems with helping anyone with these package trains - I will even help make a master list of train wishlists to help with newbies but honestly if a newbie doesn't want to take the first jump at joining no one can push them to do so! If they are intimidating with riding well guess what - all of us "regulars" were new once too

You get hooked and wanna do it again and you learn with each package train, you get to know some of the regular AWESOME members this site has to offer! It is a second home away from home that for most of us appreciate
Not everyone gets hooked, I get complaints about trains (from VWTs to packages) all the time, not everyone is awesome and a lot goes on behind the scenes that also needs to be considered.
Jezz and Sally did a lot to get these trains back on SC because of all of the lost packages and complaints, but with someone sending official complaints and members as seasoned as Lola and Sheets who have mentioned their issues (sorry to pick on you two again, but your posts stuck out in my head) - at some point Boo will just say they are not worth the hassle again, and I would rather try and fix these issues now with input from members than ignore them til it blows up

I am not pin pointing anyone rider or member, just stating the facts and my opinion - whatever Jezebel & Fallen ultimately decide to do is what we all have to live with plain and simple but with that will come other people bickering - no one can please EVERYONE!

[bargain_hunter_lola]

Not everyone gets hooked, I get complaints about trains (from VWTs to packages) all the time, not everyone is awesome and a lot goes on behind the scenes that also needs to be considered.
Jezz and Sally did a lot to get these trains back on SC because of all of the lost packages and complaints, but with someone sending official complaints and members as seasoned as Lola and Sheets who have mentioned their issues (sorry to pick on you two again, but your posts stuck out in my head) - at some point Boo will just say they are not worth the hassle again, and I would rather try and fix these issues now with input from members than ignore them til it blows up

I don't mind you "picking on me". I've got thick skin. lol

I do want to reiterate though, that I volunteered my suggestions as constructive criticism since I believe that's what this thread was created for. I have never made a formal complaint since it's my choice to ride or not. I do believe you can't make everyone happy so if I'm in the minority that's totally fine - things should stay the same.

I have no idea who or how many members are unhappy with the current train format but I do see a lot of people who are happy and I would hate for them to lose out. I remember how sadden I was last year.

My hope is that this thread is used for information purposes (to help improve) rather than as a reason to stop package trains all together. I certainly don't want to be any part of that happening.

[pumpkin9211]

Hey Folks,

I wasn’t going to comment on this at all because sometimes what I try to write (say) comes across as too harsh. I guess what I’m trying to say is that I am not picking on anyone or trying to hurt any feelings but much like Slambert, I feel I have been quiet to long.

I am so sad to see that *this* is the direction the package trains have taken. It really doesn’t seem like it is worth all the hassle anymore. NOT EVERYONE WILL BE HAPPY (myself included) ALL OF THE TIME!

A “formal complaint” made me giggle. It’s a package train on a coupon/deal sharing site. Are formal complaints really necessary?!? I don’t think so.

As Lola pointed out, the option to ride or not to ride lies with the individual. For example, I don’t have children but I don’t huff, puff and pout because a “children’s package train” is boarding. I simply don’t ride.

I can understand the frustrations surrounding the number of times you need to post… but I personally believe if you can’t (or don’t want to) be active in the thread perhaps you shouldn’t be joining a package train. From my understanding, the idea was that you sent your buddy a gift and got to know more about your fellow SC’ers.

Maybe we could try a package train where NO QUESTIONS were asked, we simply receive a list and send the package and then see if it was as much fun/not as fun/the same amount of fun as a “typical package train”??

As for limits/no limits trains. This ticks me off. When this issue was first visited by Jez- she tried/we tried to get people to join and NOBODY who asked for a “limit train” jumped on. Private messages were sent and the train did not have many riders. I’m not against a limit train (if that is what you want to ride).. However, I am against people who lodge complaints, request change and then don’t ride. What a waste of time, energy and effort!

I think post count, number of riders, limits, etc. should be left to the conductor to make(approved by Jez, of course) and it will constantly be changing and that alone should help appease the masses.

In the end I think we should all be practical about these package trains. Join the ones you want, skip the ones you don’t. Follow the rules of the train you ask to join. It *should* be this simple.

Ps. For anyone wondering why I haven’t been riding the last couple of package trains- it’s because I felt that I would be too busy to be a great buddy. Nothing against any theme, conductor, rules, requirements or Jez.

[CouponLadybird]

Hey Folks,

I wasn’t going to comment on this at all because sometimes what I try to write (say) comes across as too harsh. I guess what I’m trying to say is that I am not picking on anyone or trying to hurt any feelings but much like Slambert, I feel I have been quiet to long.

I am so sad to see that *this* is the direction the package trains have taken. It really doesn’t seem like it is worth all the hassle anymore. NOT EVERYONE WILL BE HAPPY (myself included) ALL OF THE TIME!

A “formal complaint” made me giggle. It’s a package train on a coupon/deal sharing site. Are formal complaints really necessary?!? I don’t think so.

As Lola pointed out, the option to ride or not to ride lies with the individual. For example, I don’t have children but I don’t huff, puff and pout because a “children’s package train” is boarding. I simply don’t ride.

I can understand the frustrations surrounding the number of times you need to post… but I personally believe if you can’t (or don’t want to) be active in the thread perhaps you shouldn’t be joining a package train. From my understanding, the idea was that you sent your buddy a gift and got to know more about your fellow SC’ers.

Maybe we could try a package train where NO QUESTIONS were asked, we simply receive a list and send the package and then see if it was as much fun/not as fun/the same amount of fun as a “typical package train”??

As for limits/no limits trains. This ticks me off. When this issue was first visited by Jez- she tried/we tried to get people to join and NOBODY who asked for a “limit train” jumped on. Private messages were sent and the train did not have many riders. I’m not against a limit train (if that is what you want to ride).. However, I am against people who lodge complaints, request change and then don’t ride. What a waste of time, energy and effort!

I think post count, number of riders, limits, etc. should be left to the conductor to make(approved by Jez, of course) and it will constantly be changing and that alone should help appease the masses.

In the end I think we should all be practical about these package trains. Join the ones you want, skip the ones you don’t. Follow the rules of the train you ask to join. It *should* be this simple.

Ps. For anyone wondering why I haven’t been riding the last couple of package trains- it’s because I felt that I would be too busy to be a great buddy. Nothing against any theme, conductor, rules, requirements or Jez.

well said, I couldn't agree more

[coyote00]

A picture is always worth a thousand words ...... LOL

[FallenPixels]

I am so glad that you feel the need to giggle that someone has to come to the admins because their voice is not being heard

Jezz and I decided to discuss this on the forum because we did not want Boo to say the trains are not worth it and people do want change - but the harshness of some of the posts here mean the people who complained won't even speak up on the forum because of the cliqueyness (and there are cliques, we all know it) and past experiences getting on the wrong side of those cliques

Do you know there are members who won't post in this thread because they are worried about the backlash to the point that one said "they have my address"

We get complaints that there are kid trains so people can't join, we suggest having two different smaller trains running with different themes and someone else complains that they are excluded from the second one - we can't win. But I will not have members feel bullied to the point they will not even trade with members

It seems that the regulars like the way things run, and have set the rules the way they like, but there are unhappy people - and they could become regulars given a chance, but a lot of this harshness is scaring them away. It is not necessary to post 35 times, but you will probably find that they will actually post more if not forced to with the threat of being put on a consequence list for only hitting 34 when others (as peachy mentioned she did) get away with other rule breaking

As it happens, the person who lodged the complaint just contacted me saying she will no longer be visiting SC, she prefers to be a part of a site that will actually work together to what works for all - that is not something I giggle at

[Peachykeen2007]

Who are these people, I know of a few of them and honestly they deserve to not be allowed to ride - the ones I know of have fallen under these categories

1. someone not sending a package but received one should be banned
2. someone who sends liquids in their package and they break and the rider not replacing these items even though they got FULL money back from CP should not be able to ride


I would really like to know who these people are and why they can't speak up!

On a no limit train it is not mandatory to send xx amount for a price it is mandatory to send xx amount of items, not too sure how this is excluding people from joining as I don't personally think that sending 6 items is that crazy, personally why would I spend $20 for shipping on a mere 6 items - just doesn't seem worth the postage and that is why I send the packages I do

YES everyone has a different budget and that has been discussed but still not understanding how a no limit train is excluding people with a set budget! Just because a limited train runs doesn't mean you have to spend xx amount of money - I think the problem lies that these people feel that they are out done and that they sent a crappy package compaired to some of us riders and like I have said over and over if you sent the required amount of items for that train and you are happy with what you sent who cares what the other rider's got

As for what goes on behind the scenes maybe that is the problem! All these complaints should be made aware openly to those of us who ride these train regularly, not saying a members name needs to be attached but I find it odd that none of these people who are making these complaints or these newbies who want to ride aren't speaking up in this thread

I get that if I don't want to ride a limit train I WON'T EVER! but still VERY CONFUSED as to how a person who loves to ride a train but can only afford a certain amount can't ride a no limit train????????

A no limit train is that there is no set amount spent, you agree to the train rules as to how many gifts are sent and it has always been a minimum of 6 items sent with no price attached! the no limit refers to us rider's who want to and can spoil their buddy plain and simple - not excluding the majority of us who ride these package trains from a limited train!!!

We also have a lot of people who used to ride trains before they were banned who no longer do because of the various rules.

As above, no limit may have worked with that set of riders but people are asking for limits now, so it isn't fair to those people not to at least try it.

This is part of the issue, you see it from the point of view of the regulars and longer term members on SC who have a stockpile, who have swagbucks saved up etc - some people are not as 'into it' as some of the longer term members. If you don't want to ride a limit train, don't - but why exclude those who would love to ride a train but can only afford a certain amount and can't puff the gift from their stockpile?

Not everyone gets hooked, I get complaints about trains (from VWTs to packages) all the time, not everyone is awesome and a lot goes on behind the scenes that also needs to be considered.
Jezz and Sally did a lot to get these trains back on SC because of all of the lost packages and complaints, but with someone sending official complaints and members as seasoned as Lola and Sheets who have mentioned their issues (sorry to pick on you two again, but your posts stuck out in my head) - at some point Boo will just say they are not worth the hassle again, and I would rather try and fix these issues now with input from members than ignore them til it blows up

I am not pin pointing anyone rider or member, just stating the facts and my opinion - whatever Jezebel & Fallen ultimately decide to do is what we all have to live with plain and simple but with that will come other people bickering - no one can please EVERYONE!

[bargain_hunter_lola]

As for what goes on behind the scenes maybe that is the problem! All these complaints should be made aware openly to those of us who ride these train regularly, not saying a members name needs to be attached but I find it odd that none of these people who are making these complaints or these newbies who want to ride aren't speaking up in this thread

Honestly I dont find it odd at all.

People get passionate about things they love and sometimes that passion is a little overwhelming.

Dont get me wrong, Peachy I love you! I enjoy the vwt's we've ridden together and think you're super nice but yeah, I kind of thought you might take my head off for disagreeing with you. lol. No hard feelings of course, you obviously have strong feelings and feel comfortable expressing them which is what we all want on SC, right?

The problem arises (in my opinion) when people dont feel comfortable expressing their opinion. I have thick skin, I'm okay if people want to tar and feather me (metaphor of course) but not everyone feels that way unfortunately.

[MeShell]

What about this suggestion: make the necessary changes/new rules/etc for the upcoming trains...but for the next few trains or months or whatever, maybe at the end of each train, there is a short survey that each rider will fill out and send it back to the conductor/Jezebel/Fallen/whoever for feedback. Questions like "How did your experience on this train go?", "Did you have any concerns about how this train ran?" etc etc etc. That way every rider can comfortably and privately voice their concerns/feedback and maybe then, after a few months of feedback, can see if there's any more obvious changes that need to be made?

Anyways, just a suggestion