The Official and ONLY Place to Discuss Negative Trade Experiences + Trade Blacklist

[FallenPixels]

I linked this thread, especially the part that says:

"Traders may ask for an extra for additional postage if it is a stamp/GC trade but not if coupon for coupon as you will both be using additional stamps."

Asking for an additional coupon when it is 1 coupon for 17 does seem fair if it puts them over the weight for a single stamp

[MillieH]

Ok.. we can handle it here..

[QUOTE=GregSaves;5997315]I have never encountered a more rude person on this forum than you. You offered me a trade that was completely unfair to me.

I offer 17 x $1 of your chosen coupons in exchange for the FPC (approx value 5.48 & 1 stamp
you may think this is an unfair deal but its not an unreasonable deal and not against any rules.. I was not trying to scam you as you think.. .. it was not completely unfair to you.. for the cost of 2 stamps you get a savings of $15 .. or if you do 1 stamp.. you get $16 value and i get 4.48 value.. thats how I see it.. i think it was a fair offer

I responded with a counter offer. You simply replied "no.... thanks though"

Yes I wanted the original offer, your 2nd offer was less than the first and I wasn't interested. you explained why you thought I shouldn't get a stamp.. I understood you wanted it your way and I wasn't interested... there wasnt anything wrong with that.

I replied again with another counter offer (I assumed you weren't saying "no...." to the trade itself, but to my counter offer). I responded explaining why I thought your initial offer was unfair. I linked this thread, especially the part that says:

"Traders may ask for an extra for additional postage if it is a stamp/GC trade but not if coupon for coupon as you will both be using additional stamps."

I was offended by this.. I had made a fair offer.. I was fine with you refusing it and had the same right.. your response linking to the thread implied that I wasn't trading correctly and I should read it and trade you the way you wanted me to. I felt as though you were trying to bully me.


If you had simply responded initially, or even then, that you weren't interested in negotiating any further, then I would have been more than happy to move on and not contact you again. But instead you respond with:

"Just a little FYI... No thanks.. means NO ... please don't contact me again"

I didn't know how to be more clear.


Anna is right. Things can be taken the wrong way on the internet. There is no tone of voice. But its almost impossible to not see the hostility in that comment. I was completely polite to you. I didn't try to "bully" you into accepting the trade at all. I simply gave you the least amount of coupons I would take in exchange for the FPC you were interested in. Even though it was unfair to me, as I said in my message:

"But I won't be using the FPC and I could use the delissio coupons."

You suggested I wasn't following the trading guidelines.. your response suggested I was trying to scam you.. this was definitely hostile..


When negotiating a trade, I am appreciative when the other party tries to make the trade work for me by lowering their end. I certainly don't respond with hostility.

I am a child of the internet. I'm much younger than you. I probably understand the common "rudeness" of the internet more than most people here. I try my best to avoid things like that. But there's a fine line between rudeness and going over the top.

( from your last inbox to me, after I ask you not to contact me again) "People like you disgust me. You're sickening.

You offered me an unfair deal, I declined. I contacted you again with a more unfair deal to myself, you declined. I offered you a final deal, you respond like a lunatic.

I won't be contacting you again. But I will be posting these logs in the bad trade experiences thread to show everyone how you treat other members, to go along with the fact that you ignore the rules of this forum and attempt to take advantage of others."

You state I offered you an unfair deal, that I attempt to take advantage of others.. you call me a lunatic because I said no means no..

Common decency is a trait that is just as important on the internet as it is in real life. I don't appreciate being spoken (or typed) to in that manner. Just like any other human being, you should know better.

This isn't the first time someone has tried to take advantage of me just because I'm new on this site. But it will be the last. As I mentioned in my PM, I won't be trading with you or contacting you at all in the future. I have added you to my block list.


The comment above is funny, you talk about not appreciating being typed to in that manner (I said FYI no thanks means NO) and yet you call me disgusting, sickening and a scammer. I didnt attempt to take advantage of you.. I offered you a reasonable deal.. you're an adult and able to decide what you want for your coupons , same as me. Just say no..

[GregSaves]

Asking for an additional coupon when it is 1 coupon for 17 does seem fair if it puts them over the weight for a single stamp

I agree. But it depends on the coupon. I already have 25 of the delissio coupons in question. I weighed them. 25 of them weigh 7 grams. They are very thin. I have yet to see a different variety of that coupon that expires in december.

But the weight of the coupons wasn't the issue. The issue is that I simply explained why I thought that offer was unfair to me. And I offered something else. She didn't accept the offer, so I gave her the least amount of coupons I would take. (my final offer to her was the FPC in exchange for 12 of the coupons.) That offer was MORE than fair to her. But for whatever reason she was dead-set on receiving a stamp. That in and of itself is fine. I don't think that would have made a fair trade, but I certainly NEVER "bullied" her into accepting anything.

As I mentioned earlier, if she didn't want to negotiate the trade anymore, all she had to do is simply let me know. As far as I was aware she was simply declining my offer in hopes that I would give her a better offer. The only time a problem occurred was when she responded in such a rude and hostile manner. Then, before I even noticed her rude message, she comes here to complain about me "bullying" her.

I'm perfectly content that we couldn't come to an agreement. I have offered and been offered many trades that ended up not working out. But I have never been spoken to like that or accused of something just because I sent someone an offer they didn't like. In fact, I have had more than one successful trade with many more PM's back and forth in the negotiating process. I appreciate it when someone tries to make a trade work. I certainly don't attack them and then go complain about them on the forum if the trade doesn't work out.

As far as I'm concerned this issue is closed. I won't be trading with this person in the future. There are plenty of kind and polite people that I will trade with in the future. I just wish this trade had come to its end without so much rudeness and hostility.

EDIT after I saw the messages that were posted while I was typing my reply to fallenpixels

Guys, this is not the place for this discussion

I was typing my reply to you when I noticed her message and your other reply. I submitted my message before I noticed them. As I just mentioned, this matter is closed in my eyes. So I have no intention in replying to her again other than to correct one thing. She just said:

" you call me disgusting, sickening and a scammer"

I didn't call you disgusting. I said "people like you disgust me." (i.e. people who respond like that out of the blue for no reason.). And no where in any of my messages to you did or my posts about this topic did I mention the word "scammer." So you just completely made that up.

The truth is, I believe you're a very rude and un-kind person. I don't like to deal with people like that, so I will not respond to you in any manner again in the future.

[MillieH]

Asking for an additional coupon when it is 1 coupon for 17 does seem fair if it puts them over the weight for a single stamp

Actually the coupons would have travelled for one stamp.. I looked at $ value .. If I send him 17$ value.. he uses $2 of the value to recoup stamp cost, ends with a $15 value .. and I get a $5.48 value ...\

[MillieH]

Fallen .. I will report his messages so you can see how it unfolded.. can I report my responses as well or does he have to do that?

[FallenPixels]

Moving the above posts by Millie/Greg here

[lecale]

.

[angel_2011]

can i ask... what was the fpc? and what were the coupons being traded in exchange for the fpc?

[FallenPixels]

It was actually all moved from that thread after it went south

[FallenPixels]

and that is why most people trade FPCs only for FPCs or other HV...

[GregSaves]

http://forum.smartcanucks.ca/381435-...014-v2-canada/

By this rule:


1 stamp = $5 in hand picked coupons.


So what is the value of a $5.48 max value FPC, in hand picked coupons?

Well, here's something to address in the what are trades worth thread, because there is no guideline for what a FPC is worth in hand picked coupons.

From the rules:





...these taken together (given $5 GC = $5 GC) imply that the following are equivalent:

$10 worth of FPC coupons
same in coupons
$25 reg coupons
$50 hand picked coupons
8 stamps
$5 GC

...so $10 FPC is worth $10 to $25 to $50 in coupons. So just multiply the value of the FPC by anything from 1X to 2.5X to 5X.

THEN, Because the $10 value of the FPC coupon is not its max value but the going rate for that product, use a half, or a third, of that value to determine what the FPC is worth:





So according to the rules it is real simple, just use one of the following equations:

(A) $10 FPC = 1 X $10 X 1/3 = 3.33
(B) $10 FPC = 5 X $10 X 1/2 = 25.00

...as specified in the rules.

If each $10 is worth $3.33 - $25 in coupons, then the $5.48 FPC is worth between $1.82 and $13.70

I am pleased to clear this up for everybody and I think I deserve the $10 Target GC now, just for this post.

this is my favourite emoticon on SC, I swear.

So, but, seriously, WTH I always expected to get back the max value in singles I could use. The max value is usually double what any sane person would pay, so my premium is built in.

I would say the stinker was worth $5.48 in hand picked coupons, and if that didn't seem right to me, I might ask a smidge more or just not trade it if I was that emotionally invested in it (because obviously then, I could probably use it myself).

And the 1 stamp = $5 in hand picked coupons

So, together, the pile is worth $10.48

-ish.

Maybe people want to start a discussion on FPC's in the Official Trade Rates 2014 - v2 thread ETA: About the value of a FPC in general, not this specific case

The pathology rests not in the individual, but within the trading system

Sorry you spent so much time on that

But the FPC is actually a no max value. The $5.48 value came up just as a talking point when discussing it. The number came from the price it sells for on walmart.ca. But its a Johnson Take Along pack FPC with no max value

Before the negotiation went south I used the following math in our communications to determine the value of the regular coupons in relation to the FPC:

"From the trade rates thread: $10 worth of FPC coupon(s) - same in coupons / $5 GC / $25 reg coupons
The take along pack sells for $5.48 at walmart.ca. With the math in the trade rates thread, each regular coupon is valued at $.40 for each $1 of FPC value.(10 / 25 = .40). So 14 delissio coupons would have a value of $5.60 (14 X .40= 5.6) in FPC value (the closest I could get it)."

[angel_2011]

it also depends on what kind of delissio coupons they are - hv or regular?

[lecale]

.

[MillieH]

Thanks to all who shared or will share their opinions on this.. I responded to this to share my side, not in defense.. just to show what happened. I still consider my offer to be fair and totally understood that he could refuse but find it odd that he believes I tried to scam him. I can only agree to disagree. I am going to do my best to not read this thread (not always easy lol) but will not respond again as I'd like to spend more time on things that make me feel better instead of things that drain my energy.

[Darth Penguin]

I am a child of the internet. I'm much younger than you. I probably understand the common "rudeness" of the internet more than most people here. I try my best to avoid things like that. But there's a fine line between rudeness and going over the top.

FYI..there are a lot of people here, myself inclded who were tha first generation of internet users in the late 1980's/early 1990's. We've experienced that "internet rueness" for far too many years to be talked down to by a padawan.