Shopper's plays their dirty games again

[torontogal12]

They must love all the new traffic it brings into the store

I find this fascinating first the chocolate bar promo, then the huggies promo, both ended badly and now they did it again. Jamieson Flu Shield is on for 9.99 and you receive 9000 pts.

What is up with them?

[sharkie]

they just want us in the doors before they take it away

[screamy]

Well I guess one example of fraud would be pooling the purchases of an extended family, i.e., acting as an organization made up of several households, not an individual, for financial gain. Optimum accounts are for individuals. If you create a group that pools its purchases, you are acting as an organization and misrepresenting yourself as an individual. Add in financial gain and you have fraud.

Keep in mind that not every customer is experiencing a clawback of points without notice. It is only select customers. Certainly SDM has some grounds to do so based on the declarations in their Optimum program rules, and the exceptional nature of those customers' purchases. If you are really pushing it, SDM has the right to strike back.

And then there's the law, and then there's ethics...

I think we're almost at the beating a dead horse point with this but just have to say there's a difference between "pooling a family's purchases" - by which I would understand you'd mean more than one family member who would normally buy soap/wipes/whatever would get together and agree in advance to combine their purchases to derive some incremental benefit they would otherwise not receive as you've described it above (e.g. 20x for an over $X spend), and making a purchase, as an individual, of a large quantity of whatever it was for the entire family and then giving it to those family members because those members cannot afford it themselves, and doing so when it was most beneficial for you to do so, whether by using coupons on a sale, earning BPs, or both.

There are a number of SCers, myself included, who support individuals, other than ourselves, who constitute members of our immediate families, with our purchases and coupon-related savings.

I would hasten to add that - for example - if I got the 200+ members of my condo building to "collude" with me and represented myself as only buying for my own personal use on a 20x day (in this example, by not obtaining an Optimum card for groups, etc., as fallenpixels mentioned in here somewhere), then I'd agree with your description. In that instance, I would definitely not be disclosing something that ought to have been disclosed, because they are not related to me, and a 20x day with points above a specific spend is different - I would be pooling our purchases to get to a minimum spend threshold, without which I would not receive an additional inducement.

But I don't see a difference (legally, or ethically, since you brought it up) in me buying enough soap for just myself, or for myself plus the four other family members for whom I am financially responsible. I would have bought it at SDM at some point anyway, either on a 20x day, or whenever the coupons I had on hand combined with a sale made it the most advantageous for me and my OOP spend. You can call that fraud if you feel like it, but it lacks the intent to conceal that underpins any actual legal fraud, ergo, no tort has been committed.

[Jezebel]

someone mention a few pages back that it isn't very many ppl who buy large amounts are actually buying a years worth of an item at one shopping trip...they are perhaps just buying a larger amount because of extra points/promotions....

I actually buy a years worth of many items generally in November /Dec and January....last year was my first year trying this out and it went so well I am going to do it again this year ! Some items I bought a years worth were
~kitty litter
~canned cat food..(for my moms cat)
~dry cat food (for my cat)
~aveeno products
~toothpaste/ feminin products
~soup
~condiments..mustard/ketchup ect
~deoderant
~garbage /recycle bags
~dish/laundry supplies
~4 bottles each of items such as cough syrup/tylenol/tums/ ect

I rather enjoyed not have to run to the store for these items all the time and paying full price if I have no coupon or no sale....so for SDM to decide what is reasonable amount to buy of an item may not fall into the same shopping habits of what I think is a reasonable amount of an item to purchase....

[lecale]

.

[sharkie]

someone mention a few pages back that it isn't very many ppl who buy large amounts are actually buying a years worth of an item at one shopping trip...they are perhaps just buying a larger amount because of extra points/promotions....

I actually buy a years worth of many items generally in November /Dec and January....last year was my first year trying this out and it went so well I am going to do it again this year ! Some items I bought a years worth were
~kitty litter
~canned cat food..(for my moms cat)
~dry cat food (for my cat)
~aveeno products
~toothpaste/ feminin products
~soup
~condiments..mustard/ketchup ect
~deoderant
~garbage /recycle bags
~dish/laundry supplies
~4 bottles each of items such as cough syrup/tylenol/tums/ ect

I rather enjoyed not have to run to the store for these items all the time and paying full price if I have no coupon or no sale....so for SDM to decide what is reasonable amount to buy of an item may not fall into the same shopping habits of what I think is a reasonable amount of an item to purchase....

I did the same last year also....it worked out great for me....the dh and I are just starting to get low on our razors and a few other things....I have not bought bleach for a year...lol...the one thing I find very interesting was last year I went to 2 different SDMs and bought 100 small bottles of bleach...they were on for 99 cents and I had $1 of coupons....there was no bonus points and I got them free and never had any problems with SDM...it truly seems that it is their Optimum program that is creating alot of the problems...

[lessthannat]

Sharkie, did you consider that maybe someone complained about you at the store level? I find it VERY strange that you had to encounter this and other people did not, I do not believe it was random checking
I just find this whole situation very odd, IDK

[lessthannat]

And I would like to add, that yes I too purchase a years supply of certain products at one time or another - laundry soap, toilet paper, paper towels, body wash, soap, shampoo etc - if the sale is good enough I will stock up, and personally I see nothing wrong with this

[coley3]

And I would like to add, that yes I too purchase a years supply of certain products at one time or another - laundry soap, toilet paper, paper towels, body wash, soap, shampoo etc - if the sale is good enough I will stock up, and personally I see nothing wrong with this

I think it is just good shopping

[anastasia1009]

And I would like to add, that yes I too purchase a years supply of certain products at one time or another - laundry soap, toilet paper, paper towels, body wash, soap, shampoo etc - if the sale is good enough I will stock up, and personally I see nothing wrong with this

but according to most points programs and some stores that is excessive for the average family. For my training for a points program most programs teach u what an average family, household and sometimes small businesses - all depends on the point system. I was taught average family is 4 for most places except up north could be up to six and Quebec average was 3. And when families bought items 4 to 6 items that was ok and accepted or even for redeeming but anything beyond that was excessive and beyond 10 we use to cards or do some homework on cards. Point systems are very sneaky, they gather your shopping habits and you think that going to another store will throw them off but it makes them more suspicious. Once you make a purchase by credit card or debit they can track everything. And you have a credit card that collects the points its even worse. There is a common program they use that we can tell home time you purchase what items and where and if you went to other locations. Then people said why not open another card and transfer they will can still trace you and compare cards you use to make purchases. Even managers can call in to you card or cancel or suspend or to run a check on you. You would have to make all purchases with cash and give them fake information. But they could your card for redeeming until they got correct information. So you could collect, see your points but redeem they would block it.
After working 4+ years in various positions on a points card I know they are in control and can track you and your spending habits. I have an optimum card but so careful and I don't want to go through the hassle with finding ways to collect points. I rather go to WM or NF to get it cheaper and hassle free sometimes. Free is nice but was it worth all the pain and headache

[newbiesaver]

anatasia1009, I really appreciate your insights into the points programs from an "insider's" perspective. I think we can argue what's considered reasonable or not all day if we want and we could all conclude that stockpiling a year's worth is smart shopping rather than scamming but at the end of the day, it doesn't matter what WE think is reasonable or legitimate. It's what the points program sponsor decides. And they've certainly written their right to be judge, jury, and executioner into their fine print as someone mentioned a few pages back.

And yes, you could be 110% confident that you'll be proven right in a court of law and yes, everyone here may agree with you but unfortunately, the average person doesn't have the time, money, knowledge, or even the will to take such a fight to court. So I think we all just have to be aware that this may happen when it comes to SDM - they play by their rules and it may not always be worth it to fight them.

I'm just afraid what if they ban you permanently? True I don't think we should feel held hostage by these big companies but at the same time, it's kind of reality as well. Unfortunately, I know of people who were banned from Coach, Victoria Secret, etc. for either purchasing too many items and/or returning too many. They were accused of being resalers or chronic returners and even though that may not have actually been the case, these big companies were careful enough in their policies that they covered their behinds with the right to ban at "their discretion." And the whole well, it's bad PR for them doesn't work when dealing with companies on this big scale - they just don't care.

[lessthannat]

You know, all this can be avoided if SDM just made their 'reasonable' usage known to customers, or just place limits on the product - IDK why it has to come to this and why people need to be worried about losing their points each time they want to take advantage of a good deal. Seriously SDM - get your s*&t together and stop targeting the customers who take advantage of the deals your marketing department is putting out

grr

[sharkie]

Sharkie, did you consider that maybe someone complained about you at the store level? I find it VERY strange that you had to encounter this and other people did not, I do not believe it was random checking
I just find this whole situation very odd, IDK

No it was not at store level...if you go look on their Facebook page you will always read lots of horror stories about SDM....I know that it has happened to alot of other people too.....as for anyone complaining, 17 packs of Nivea is not alot....why did no one complain a year ago when I got the bleach and used coupons....I know why, because there was no bonus points attached....they have a reward card but they do not want anyone getting alot of rewards....

[DianneS]

I have been following this thread but refrained from commenting until now. I know that some of us purchase a year supply of items but no matter how you try to 'slice or dice it' there is no way it constitutes typical shopping behaviour by the vast majority of consumers. I don't like the 'after the fact' changes they have pulled lately either, and I think they should be intelligent enough to figure the issues out before the promo. That said, I also think it is wise to stay under the radar. SDM controls the progam and holds the power....why jeopardize ones points because 'technically' one should be allowed to buy 100 chocolate bars, 35 boxes of wipes,etc. I prefer to keep my purchases reasonable, enjoy the points and the products and stay off their hit list. It just seems practical to me

(Sent byiPhone so hopefully the auto corrects are not too wild)

[sharkie]

I have been following this thread but refrained from commenting until now. I know that some of us purchase a year supply of items but no matter how you try to 'slice or dice it' there is no way it constitutes typical shopping behaviour by the vast majority of consumers. I don't like the 'after the fact' changes they have pulled lately either, and I think they should be intelligent enough to figure the issues out before the promo. That said, I also think it is wise to stay under the radar. SDM controls the progam and holds the power....why jeopardize ones points because 'technically' one should be allowed to buy 100 chocolate bars, 35 boxes of wipes,etc. I prefer to keep my purchases reasonable, enjoy the points and the products and stay off their hit list. It just seems practical to me

(Sent byiPhone so hopefully the auto corrects are not too wild)

but my issue is, what radar... how are we suppose to know if they do not let us know....that is the part I do not like....I have gone shopping at many other stores and I respect whatever limits they say....SDM never lets it`s customers know anything....