a tough decision

[abbasgirl]

Aw, Dealsniffer, try not to beat yourself up over this! You've done the best you could for him. No one could possibly look at your situation and think you're a horrible person! But you've got to do what's best for your family. This must be terrifying for Felix!

[dealsniffer]

Minou and avoncallingyou you are very right. my considerations for what I am doing is for the safety of people in my family and people who would come in contact with her if she would go to another home. one thing my mom said that made sense today is that she doesn't even seem to understand the damage she can do with her mouth. She has such a strong mouth that she could crush a hand if she seriously bit it. we go through so many toys because she destroys them because her mouth is so strong. thanks for the suggestions. I can look into the spca further maybe and see if they will even look at her. they are so backed up right now though-the last time I called I was told I would be put on a waiting list if I decided to give up my dog. I suppose it would give me more time to look into other stuff but I am growing increasingly worried over Felix's safety especially. she doesn't seem to understand that she is too big and she is hurting him. when she hurt him this week-he made alot of noise that he was hurt and she didn't even seem to care. I don't think she intends to kill him but if she would get to him and get her mouth around his neck again and squeaze it a little too hard.... or if we have to get something from her mouth that she has to let go of like this morning. she was snarling with teeth bared and I worried about her biting one of us. I know you are not supposed to show fear (Ceser Milan says that) but it is pretty hard not to. she is stronger than I am and so I can't control her. she can be good part of the time but not all the time. I am sorry to go on about this but I am having such a hard time with this. it seems so complicated. like I wish I had a crystal ball to know what she does so I can prevent it or if she would be fine to go to another home. We have to always be very firm with her and always be sure to show we are dominant and if she goes to someone who isn't firm with her then who knows what she will do? I would feel responsible obviously.

[dealsniffer]

abbasgirl oddly Felix is not smart in that respect-he taunts her and goes close to her and that is what makes it more difficult. if he would be scared of her it might be easier to keep them apart because he would hide. I don't understand if he is trying to live dangerously or what. yet ever since the incident this week he has kept his distance more. but he still tries to get close and get her attention. I don't know if it's jealousy or something that he feels he isn't getting attention from me that he tries to get her attention? the two of them are a recipe for disaster. the thing is he is not very dominant of a cat and very laid back and has never really fought back except a few occasions that he actually hissed at her. that was the first time I heard him hiss since he was a kitten. only twice has he hissed ever in his life. he is my baby and like no cat I have ever had and so special and I can't imagine anything happening to him. him and I had some problems early on but I was able to fix it. I suppose he is the closest to a dog I will get. lol

[Crochetlady]

This is a difficult decision to make. I did it years ago on the advice of my vet. The dog was very agressive, my nieces who were about 5 at the time were afraid to come to my house and when she bit me when I petted her it was the last straw. I never regretted doing it because I was afraid she would hurt a kid and I couldn`t have lived with that. Sometimes it needs to be done.

[fourfurryfeet]

I will PM you!

[FallenPixels]

Honestly, from a shelter point of view, make the hard decision. Dogs like that never do well in a shelter environment (and if you dont make past aggressive behaviour known and they bite, the surrender contracts can be very explicit in legal obligations). The dog will have some respect for you as its owner, even if untrained but left in a shelter, they will bite in the unknown environment

The ONLY time I have seen these types of dogs rehomed and it worked is when they were taken on by police for training (but they wont take pitbulls here at least) or they have been allowed to be guard dogs.

Assuming training doesn't work, thats all I can suggest, but look into training first

[Lynn49]

Lynn we have done all of that. We have spent alot of time reading and watching Ceser's stuff. the biting has always been a problem and possibly not even because of her being a pit bull. some dogs just have biting problems. but even as a 4month old puppy she was already getting too strong to be able to hold our hands around her mouth and now she is way stronger than that and when she starts biting-you can't get your hands close to her face without the possibility of losing a finger. we always have a leash on her in the house and outside of the house because we can't trust her and Felix to be together without us having the ability to grab her and pull her away. a gentle tug on the leash does nothing though. also she is getting way too strong for me because I am not fully recovered and I can't handle her when she gets going. she bites whether she is calm or excited. she just does it.
We don't want to put her down and we are going to talk to the vet first of course but we have tried to do what we can to find her a home-trust me! Also we are no stranger to bringing up dogs. We have trained quite a few dogs and had them through obedience and we know some stuff. This isn't something simple and I am not giving up easily and i have been fighting for her for so long and trying to find her a new home but everywhere I turn-it doesn't work out. The spca won't take her either because there is a waiting list to take in dogs because they are overrun with dogs. I feel so extremely stuck with a dog that I can't seem to get rid of and I can't seem to get to a point that we can co exist. I also know that I can't really pass her off to someone else anyways because she has issues. I can't not say what issues she has either. There are sooo many dogs available around here that people would just go find another dog. this isn't a simple situation. maybe the vet does know someone that would be able to handle her. I don't know.
I don't want to be labeled a horrible person or a monster for wanting to get rid of her even though I feel like one. please don't hate me. We have tried so hard to do everything we possibly could. I just can't do any more. I understand though if people think I shouldn't own another dog-right now I don't think I should either. I am heartbroken because despite her being difficult-I have spent so much time and energy with her and have grown to love her. I am so upset right now and feel horrible. I don't know what to do.

Oh, Deals, no one is judging you here...we're just trying to offer suggestions...I didn't know you had tried those methods before this.
I'm so sorry you're in this position and I hope and pray there's a good resolution to this for you and your pooch...

[Patty Smyth]

This will seem harsh but I would get rid of it. I would either put it down or give it to someone who is willing to take the risk and retrain it but not all dogs are suitable as pets. If I remember correctly you do not know much about it's origins and were only told later it was part "pit bull". With pit bulls it's not the breed it's the breeding. Totally not the dogs fault nor is it yours. I think you have tried your best but since you are fearful, with reason, it might be time to let go.

Having seen what a dog can do to a childs face I would never take a chance with a biter like that. My son's best friend was mauled in the face when he was 7 and nearly lost an eye and it was not a pitbull believe it or not it was a golden retriever so you never know.

[dealsniffer]

thanks everyone for your comments. I am rather frustrated because we phoned the vet and they will not put down a dog that is healthy physically. basically what they said as far as I understand is that if she hasn't bit anyone then they won't do anything. or in other words she has to harm someone and scar the person for life before they consider it. the advice we were given by the vet was to find someone who wants a guard dog. I was shocked by this because first to encourage her to be aggressive is bad and if she bites someone then the owner is in trouble, second if she would be trained that way and she gets loose-who will get hurt? 3rd-she is fear aggressive with strangers and so she would make a bad guard dog. this is also why we can't have her out when company comes over because of the way she is around strangers. maybe fear aggressive behavior can be helped? I don't know but for the vet to encourage the behavior is surprising. especially with the pit bull in her-she should never be used as a guard dog.
with us it is more a dominant agressive behavior possibly. maybe someone very firm would be able to show her who is in control? we have been firm to the absolute best of our abilities but it doesn't seem to change things.
you know she is like Jekyll and hyde. every once in awhile she has a day where she behaves and is good and then we are like oh she is getting better. then she is back to her old ways. so she is unpredictable. today is one of her good days and she only snarled at me twice this morning. but that is a good day for her. I don't want a dog that I can't trust. maybe someone could train her properly that has extreme experience in these kinds of dogs? I know that we thought we were experienced and she is waaaay beyond what we know how to deal with. Fallenpixels I really agree with what you said about the shelter not neccessarily being the best place. all I know is that we need to find somewhere that will take her because she can't stay here.
what is really irking me is that I was wanting a dog to do therapy work in seniors homes. I said this to the people we got her from and they were like oh she would be great for that. when we were seeing her for the first time-she was all excited and nipping and apparently that was a behavior she had never shown before. I was so stupid to overlook that. I thought to myself that from our experience that nipping could be controlled because we have done it before. from what I can tell by the way she acted was that they probably considered the nipping as part of playing with the dog and unknowingly encouraged it. but we soon found out that her nipping was more than just a one time thing. I know better and I overlooked it. thanks for listening and offering advice. I really appreciate it!