Ketogenic diet

[blueeyetea]

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1...?dopt=Abstract

Dietary protein and weight reduction: a statement for healthcare professionals from the Nutrition Committee of the Council on Nutrition, Physical Activity, and Metabolism of the American Heart Association.

Here's an article that's younger than October 2001 - a lot of research has been done since then.

http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com...ch-diet-works/

[lecale]

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[Patty Smyth]

[Patty Smyth]

[DH666]

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[blueeyetea]

If the low carb works for you, great but I can assure you it did not for me.

Ah, but saying you prefer not to use a low-carb diet is different than stating that it's not heart healthy unless you've tried and and stuck with it. If you got bogged down in the first week with brain fog and decided to stop, it wasn't because it wasn't working. Truthfully, if doctors say a calorie is a calorie, a 4 ounce piece of steack is equal in calories to 1 cup of pasta. Yes, the steak has the saturated fat, but it send a message to your brain that's it full. The cup of pasta will spike your blood with sugar and leave you hungry. Of course, you can curb that with adding protein like tofu to your pasta, but all you need to add to the steak is a big salad which is very low in calories.

We're basically saying the same thing from different perspectives, but if you're someone that's having problems with cravings and feeling hungry all the time, it's not eating more carbs that will help you, but eating more protein.

[blueeyetea]

The reason you get dizzy, depressed, foggy, irritable with Atkins is the brain does not have enough carbs - you need at least 200g a day to power that thing.

Carbs, however are very important. Eat carbs and your body releases insulin, which increases your blood tryptophan levels, which increases the amount of serotonin in the brain - and serotonin is the brain chemical that makes you happy and sated. Antidepressants like SSRI's (selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors) do not work on anorexics because they are not eating enough carbs to have enough serotonin in the brain...if it is just not there you cannot prevent its reuptake. (Anyone follow that?) Anyway the Rx is "eat carbs".

Carbs are important, but not at such a high level. It just doesn't make any sense that people in the ice age were able to grow fruits and vegetables when the earth was covered in snow and ice. Yes, we've involved from then, but not that much if you're trying to lose weight! So how do you explain that anomalie?

And if a rise in insulin was a cure for raising the amount of serotonin in the brain, imagine, depression could be cured by pigging out on a bag of chips. An anorexic person is someone who doesn't eat, period. When was the last time you've heard someone get anorexic because they were eating meat every day? Although anti-depressants may help with serotonin, they are used to treat the emotions around the disorder, and not curing the disorder because of a lack of carbs. And since you're using tryptophan as a justification for the high level of carbs required in the diet, know also that turkey is one of the best sources. So, that argument isn't working well to justify higher carbs.

But ok, let's say you're right and you absolutely need to eat a minimum 200 grams a day. When exactly is your body supposed to start using the fat that's already stored in your body if the carbs are always in your system? If there are carbs in the blood stream, the insulin will keep parking the fat until the carbs in the blood are used up. If there are too many carbs in the blood, insulin takes the extra the body doesn't need and parks it as well. When the body needs energy, it will go for the sugars stored in the cells first. When those are used up, then it goes to get the fat.

So my question is how do you determine the optimum level of carbs to ensure you have just the right level for your daily needs, but not so much that will prevent your body from using the fat stores?

[DH666]

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[blueeyetea]

The reason you get dizzy, depressed, foggy, irritable with Atkins is the brain does not have enough carbs - you need at least 200g a day to power that thing.

Oh, another thing that just occured to me, the Atkins diet also relies on counting net carbs, which is the total number of carbs in a portion minus the grams of fiber. So one cup of steamed cauliflower equals 5.2 g of carbs, minus 2.2 of fiber for a total of 3 g of net carbs. On the other hand, eating one cup of pasta equals 40 grams of carbs minus 6.4 fiber, for a total of 33.6 net carbs. Carb wise, it would take 11 cups of cauliflower to equal 1 cup of pasta to get the same amount of carbs.

If someone is losing weight it makes more sense to eat that one cup of cauliflower, or even two, instead of that one cup of pasta to feel full. The cauliflower will also not spike the sugars in the blood like the pasta will triggering cravings. If someone starts on the Atkins diet, the goal in the first two weeks is 20 to 30 g of net carbs, not total carbs which may be closer to 100 grams. (After the two weeks, net carbs are increased in small increments until the tolerance level is determined.) I don't think there's any evidence out there that replacing pasta or rice with vegetables has killed anyone.

So, if someone is suffering from brain fog due to a low-carb diet, it's most likely because they aren't calculating their numbers properly to make sure they are getting enough carbs for their daily needs.

[blueeyetea]

Going vegan has had no adverse effects, no headaches, cravings, nothing like that. There is no withdrawl and in fact you feel better rather quickly even if you do not lose any weight. JMO

Well, it's funny you should say that because every publication I've read concerning converting to a vegetarian or vegan diet always mentions it, and the recommendation is always to switch gradually, starting with removing meat once a week, and building up from there.

Since we're discussing using diet to treat immiment health issues, it wouldn't make sense to be vegan one day a week when you need results *right now*. So a period of detox is highly likely. So, if the detox (brain fog) experienced from a low-carb diet is used a justification to not go on a low-carb diet, well the same argument also needs to be applied about embarking on a vegan diet. In other words, if the detox is justifiable to stay away from a low-carb diet, it's also justifiable to stay away from the vegan as well.

[blueeyetea]

A low carb diet full of saturated fat is not the way I want to go. In the long run, it's not a heart healthy diet. I would rather lose a few less pounds, feel way better and avoid a heart attack down the road by sticking to a diet my body thrives on.

I have to apologize if I misinterpreted what you said. I thought "it's not a heart healty diet" seemed pretty clear to me.

[lecale]

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[DH666]

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[lecale]

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[Patty Smyth]